And no, I’m not talking about pirating on the internet, I’m talking about getting your internet connection to the outside world without paying or having a subscription or license. Something like a mesh network with your neighbors with the exit node being one person’s high-speed fiber line, or even an exit node through a free public wifi network that you’ve hidden a little repeater device within range of… something like that could be interesting. I’ve been thinking lately of a world where decentralized networks become more common, and where people can freely use the internet without paying an ISP. What are your thoughts?

  • SaneMartigan@aussie.zone
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    Yeah. Twenty years ago. I worked for two ISPs over the years. At both of them the test accounts for support to use were unmonitored accounts due to how many places they were used and logged in by. In both cases I simply put those login details into my home setup and got free internet for probably about three years. Before that some friends got a un/pw file from a university and decrypted a few hundred names and passwords for accounts which gave free dialup access to students. Again multiple logins seemed allowed so the only person losing was the uni/isp. Used to be able to pull about ~14gb a month through a dialup connection. Probably via napster, kazaa and soulseek, I can’t remember if torrents were a thing back then.

    • SwizzleStick@lemmy.zip
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      18 hours ago

      We shoulder-surfed a tech back in the 90s when he was getting us set up. Thus, the “HAHA FREE” dialup connection was born.

      Gave years of service to our old beige box.

  • Bags@piefed.social
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    Many many years ago in the paleolithic era when 2.4GHz was king, a neighbor in the next unit over had an unsecured wifi network… I connected my old laptop, figured out where the connection was best (turned out to be beside the stove in the kitchen?), piped the connection out the ethernet port and into the WAN port on my router, and set up my own “secured” network lol. I’m fairly certain anyone with a straight-up unsecured wifi network doesn’t have the skills or knowledge to detect someone leaching their bandwidth. I did that for like 3 years without a single hiccup until I moved and finally had to start paying.

    • selokichtli@lemmy.ml
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      Ah, yes, the WEP key passphrase era. I was a student then, and you could find me on the roof trying to get a stable signal to inject and capture data packets. Otherwise, no internet for me.

    • albert180@piefed.social
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      Or he believes in sharing his internet like the Freifunk People do.

      Not everyone who is sharing something for free with you is a moron you’re taking advantage of. Pretty disgusting worldview

      • MachineFab812@discuss.tchncs.de
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        They said “pretty sure”, not certain. Statistically, they were right, until routers started shipping with “secured” wifi settings by default. Nowadays, its the reverse.

        • Bags@piefed.social
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          It wasn’t super relevant to the story, but yeah, I could just browse the files right on their PC, definitely a “Not intending to share it for free” kind of situation, completely devoid of any authentication or security.

  • Ebby@lemmy.ssba.com
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    About 10 years ago, I just moved and my new neighbor had an open network. Problem was they were 2 houses away and across the street. I set up a tiny repeater in my car with a battery pack and parked half way between us.

    It worked surprising well for about 6 months.

  • lichtmetzger@discuss.tchncs.de
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    Vodafone has a hotspot service here in Germany. All of their cable routers have a second wifi network everyone can use (unless you opt out).

    When they introduced it, it had a big flaw: They stored the MAC address of your device in their database as authorized, but never deleted it.

    Hypothetically speaking, you could pay for a month, cancel the service and then browse for over a year until they noticed you and kicked you out. 😆

    But I would never do that, of course.

  • ThorrJo@lemmy.sdf.org
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    Back when I was housing insecure but still had a place of my own to live, I first set up a point-to-point wifi link to some kids across the street to defray my internet expenses - they paid part of my bill instead of having their own internet. That was more than a decade ago and the hardware & software weren’t so reliable. When the arrangement fell apart and I no longer could pay the bill, I cracked the network of some neighbors in my building and used the same antenna to provide internet for myself and 3 others in my house for about a year. The neighbors were a nice young couple so I did my best to be decent about it - set up an always-on permanent VPN and used flow control to limit our max throughput.

    It’s still possible to do this, and I’m still broke, so after a few years not needing to do any such thing, I cracked a network to have internet during a housesitting gig (house did not have internet).

    Edit: get WiFi 6 or better gear for this. Trust me, the improvement in performance in marginal situations is well worth it. WiFi 6 was a big improvement over WiFi 5, which was a big improvement over WiFi 4, when it comes to staying connected and getting data across a dodgy link. I haven’t done much straight up piracy lately but I have done plenty of leeching in parking lots, and WiFi 6 gear is absolutely worth the money.

  • Brickfrog@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    Nope, I prefer being able to run my own network router, open/close my own ports, block ads on the network, hopefully get as much bandwidth as I can, etc. so it’s usually better for me to subscribe to my own internet.

    … But since you bring it up, coincidentally I currently live on a street with shops/restaurants on the main floor under me. And all their wifi networks are visible from my apartment… so technically yeah, if I go through the trouble of collecting all their wifi passwords I could just hang out on their networks for free internet. Internet probably wouldn’t be great and not very private without a VPN but for free web browsing it should work.

    • ThorrJo@lemmy.sdf.org
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      Pirating wifi doesn’t preclude any of this. See also the GL.iNet devices, such as the GL-MT3000.

    • Barbecue Cowboy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      There are options out there to utilize multiple wifi networks at the same time, you probably wouldn’t have what you need to get a fancy ‘similar to enterprise level’ solution going, but there are a bunch out there with the goal of using multiple networks purely for speed.

  • seathru@lemmy.sdf.org
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    Kind of I guess. Didn’t have home internet so I would park my car in a home depot parking lot with a laptop torrenting off the public wifi and then walk the rest of the way to work.

    • ThorrJo@lemmy.sdf.org
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      WiFi 6 has made this a lot more viable than it used to be. I’ve done a fair amount of parking lot leeching and new gear is worth it.

  • zout@fedia.io
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    About 20 years ago, there was only dial-up internet available in my street. My parents lived about 200 m away from me in another street, and they could get ADSL. So I set up a wireless bridge to them, and it worked surprisingly well after some tweaking. Kept it running for a few years, eventually got my own connection because one day my dad called me because he needed the router password. Turns out he was also sharing the connection with his neighbour who was running an internet radio station.

  • skankhunt42@lemmy.ca
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    Back in the WEP/WPS days it was easy enough to use aircrack-ng and get access to a network. Anything public is likely to be slow and probably no access to open ports or manage it in any way.

    I’m paying ~$45 CAD/month for a symmetrical 500Mbps line and I think its worth it. I’d never share this with anyone I don’t know because my name is on it, anything anyone does will come back to me.

    • OsrsNeedsF2P@lemmy.ml
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      I’d never share this with anyone I don’t know because my name is on it, anything anyone does will come back to me.

      I’m the opposite. I keep no password on my wifi so I have plausible deniability

      • Creat@discuss.tchncs.de
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        Just as s comment for someone else reading this: if this actually has a chance to protect you is highly dependant on your local laws. Even then, at least from my understanding, any lawsuit has to progress relatively far (involving lawyers to a significant degree) for this to become potentially relevant.

        • AlteredEgo@lemmy.ml
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          It would probably be safer legally to have a long range wifi and let users sign up for free, after agreeing to obey the laws. And then some kind of no-log or worthless-log policy.

          • Creat@discuss.tchncs.de
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            Here that doesn’t change or help in any way. You’re the one on the contract for the Internet access, so you’re responsible. That’s it.

            You can operate as an ISP, but the requirements and responsibilities that go with that make this a non-starter. From my (limited) understanding, it includes that if you can’t provide the identity of someone who is being sued (including piracy, but also any other law breaking), you’re responsible.

    • 10001110101@lemm.ee
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      Yeah, I used aircrack to gain access to one of my neighbors wifi and used it for about a month when I moved into my first apartment. After I got my own connection, I set up a guest network/SSID that was open,

    • ☂️-@lemmy.ml
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      10 hours ago

      access to open ports or manage it in any way

      they usually leave the default passwords on their router management

    • BackYardIncendiary@lemmy.sdf.org
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      When our local internet provider (Telus) first distributed wifi routers around 2004, they didn’t turn on encryption by default. I think I made use of nodes in the “neighbour net” for about three years before the majority began setting up WEP.

  • RagingHungryPanda@piefed.social
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    There are a few towns that became their own internet providers b/c the big guys wouldn’t bring them either any or adequate service and they realized they could do it themselves more cheaply. They had to fight anti-socialism propaganda and of course lobbying and disinformation campaigns from the big providers, despite the fact that they had no intention of ever going there.

  • Mordikan@kbin.earth
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    So, this was more common when WEP encryption was used. You could just listen to the radio traffic of the given network and collect IVs which the encryption would leak. Once you had enough pieces you could reassemble the key and access the network. When WPA came out it was harder, but tools like pyrit and john the ripper helped, so long as you were able to capture the 4-way TCP handshake.

    To actually see the networks, you would build biquad parabolic antennas from old DirecTV dishes people left behind. They were very directional high gain antennas that you would just target at someone’s house. We’d also build cantennas from junk laying around. Those were interesting days.

    • TheFogan@programming.dev
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      lol I did that for a while when I was broke… for quite some time I rigged up my linksys router with wrt, set it up as a repeater for my neighbors wifi after cracking it.

      Of course the real irony was after cracking it, I realized I could have cracked it much easier with a phone book (after realizing my local ISP, just used the persons phone number as the WEP key)

  • rirus@feddit.org
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    There is freifunk in Germany they use Mesh Network -> Router > VPN to another Country so they dont get Problems by People pirating.

  • Kit@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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    When I was living in a car I’d wardrive nightly to find Wifi. This was before Wifi was commonly available in public spaces, and household routers often used a default password or no password at all. I’d use it to pirate games and movies to keep myself entertained.

    Later I moved into a 4 plex apartment and convinced the neighbors to share one Internet connection. We ran ethernet through walls and across the roof and split the bill.

  • Admiral Patrick@dubvee.org
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    When I was in college, I rented a house just outside my budget and found I couldn’t afford things like cable internet.

    I had a wifi->ethernet bridge that was originally to connect my OG Xbox to a wifi network. I also had neighbors with Wifi using WEP encryption. An idea was born.

    Was able to use aircrack-ng on my laptop to crack their WEP key in about 15 minutes. Plugged that key into my wifi->ethernet bridge, and then hooked that into my router. Bam, my whole house was online.

    That worked for probably a year and a half.

      • IllNess@infosec.pub
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        Aircrack-ng still works as a packet sniffer and a wifi detector but breaking WPA is way more difficult than breaking WEP. No one basically uses WEP anymore.

      • Admiral Patrick@dubvee.org
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        AFAIK, yes. Though I haven’t tried it with WPA3.

        While WEP is dead, you can still use it to capture the WPA/2 handshake and run it through something like John the Ripper to try to recover the passphrase.

        Admittedly, I haven’t messed with it in years.

        Either way, you still need a wireless adapter that’s capable of promiscuous mode as well as a driver for it that supports packet injection (not sure how rare that is nowadays).