Debian is basically Ubuntu without Snap.
You can switch. Just sayin.
last time i reformatted was in the pandemic. dunno when next time is gonna be, but it’s definetly gonna debian or fedora instead of ubuntu.
Good to know. I hate snap anyway
Official response of the Discourse moderators: https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/on-discourse-rules-about-politics/66986
The mods say that the mistake was in the misinterpretation of “queer” as a slur (because it used to be a slur), but they also mention that they privately discussed with the new user to convince them to remove a trans flag from the profile… and the mods didn’t really explain in the response why this happened…?
As always, read the response to make your own judgement.
I don’t see where the mods made them change it. (Edit: I see it now. If you check the edit history on the post, it shows who made the edits, in this case it was DIscourse mod wild_man.)
Also, why is this a link to reddit?
The post on Mastodon has a screenshot of the post edit history:
And a copy-pasted response from a moderator (the most relevant bit):
So in my opinion, if your intention was to show political support for diversity, you should avoid using this flag. This will allow us to refuse the use of a flag for instance saying ‘non-queer’, If we allow your flag, then we have to admit also other similar political flags, both supporting and opposing diversity.
The flag wasn’t removed?
“If we allow your flag, then we have to admit also other similar political flags, both supporting and opposing diversity.”
Consider the following: no, they don’t.
Crazy statement, if we accept the gays we should accept the nazis too.
Our terminal liberalism forbids us from saying one thing is better or worse than another thing !
You have to understand, it just wouldn’t be fair to put inclusion over exclusion ! You care about equality, don’t you?
Sure, up to the point where they harass someone or attack them, or have a history of doing so. A belief of “I think some people do not deserve to exist” is different from a belief of “People should be allowed to X” or “People who Y should not be harassed”. A nazi sympathizer who thinks nazis shouldn’t be attacked is fine, a nazi who attacks others is not.
Nah, fuck nazis. They don’t deserve to exist.
I agree in principle, but you’re not going to win any battles with that mindset. They’ll just respond with “so much for the tolerant left”. Victimization is a beloved pastime for them.
A brick is approaching a Nazi’s teeth from an initial distance of 10m horizontally and a velocity of 10m/s. You may assume the absence of air resistance and treat the brick as a point mass.
Calculate the initial angle(s) required to remove the most teeth and determine whether the Nazi can complain about the tolerant left before a brick removes their ability to speak.
People unironicly think being trans is a political statement. People are really dumb.
But why must they also allow bigotry if they allow people to express who they are? That is the biggest load of shit. So if I say “I have a husband of X years,” they must also allow someone to say a bunch of bigotry as a counter view?
Or if I say I like open source software they must allow the trolls that want to call me a dirty hippie and tell me to get a job so I can pay for software? And I agree everything is political, and ignoring it doesn’t make it any less so.
But there aren’t any political flags on there…
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I take offense at this. I am autistic, this mod in question is just a bigot.
What I want to know now is whether this mod is associated with Canonical in any capacity.On further research, this happened on the official Ubuntu boards, not Reddit as the link here implies. That makes this even more egregious. Canonical employees and official Ubuntu maintainers are responsible for this brazen homophobia. I gave up Ubuntu some time ago over Snaps and other creepy capitalist behavior, but this is a new low I didn’t expect from them.
People, don’t use Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu, or anything from Canonical. It you need Debian compatibility try Mint or Debian, otherwise try Fedora. Bazzite is also amazing if all you do is play games. Canonical is just as evil and corrupt as the other big companies.
I’m not sure why you’re moralizing so hard. I dont use ubuntu or any of their products.
In the first line I was attempting to make a joke, since I am autistic and the mod - or mods - clearly are bigots.
The post-strikethrough comments aren’t directed at you, but at the disgusting behavior of Canonical. I’m sincerely sorry if I didn’t make that part quite clear. ☹️
I remember earlier this year when conservatives used autism to justify elon’s nazi salutes.
Don’t be like that.
I’m still pissed about this. they didn’t give half a shit about being considerate about autism before
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It’s neat how the surest way to get a drive by internet autism diagnosis is just to do something bigots like.
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That response does not appear on the Ubuntu site. There is no source on the mastodon paste.
The OP on Mastodon shared screenshots of the replies (can’t tell if they were originally in the forum post, or if it’s a DM):
Okay, that’s pretty difficult to read but it’s something.
But I checked the Ubuntu Discourse thread just now, and the statement “I am queer” has been restored by a mod. Hopefully the other mods are reminded of the policies they’re supposed to be following.
I thought they just went with “if you upgrade you will break it”.
I think this might be getting overblown a bit. I think if this is a communication to an internal community, like in any job, you’d not want people sharing deeply personal information about their sexual orientation and whatnot.
If I started a new corporate job and started just spouting “Hey, I’m [sexual orientation]” around the office or in chat rooms, I’d probably expect to be notified that it’s not going to be acceptable in a professional environment. I think the Furry thing would also probably be advised against because, regardless of the actual nature, it may make people uncomfortable.
This person has every right to be announcing this as part of their identity in social settings, but it’s not shocking if it’s not allowed in a professional setting. The uncomfortable meter goes both ways, same as if someone else walks around the office spouting their cis-straight identity or religious bullshit. If it’s making people uncomfortable, they should also have to curb that speech to stop upsetting people in the larger group. I don’t think anyone has come up with a golden solution to solve for this that I’m aware of.
There doesn’t seem to be any clarifying information on the nature of the list this was part of or anything, so it’s really hard to get the context. If this was a corporate and public communication, it’s not shocking if it was going against some corporate speak no-no bullshit. 🤷
Edit: Christ, I’m not even saying controversial and I’m being brigaded ffs 🤣
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Being trans has nothing to do with someones sexuality. Just because everything is sexual to you doesnt mean its like that for other people. To be clear, just so you dont get confused. This is an example of you mistaken what being trans is, not anyone else.
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You’d be pretty surprised what conversational topics would reveal one’s implied sexuality that no one would probably push back against, because it’s “normal.” For instance, I recall straight people announcing at my work that they’d been trying for a kid or their partner was pregnant. :|
Inferring something from a conversation is way different than someone advertising it. It’s also way different in a social setting with co-workers versus the office, which in this context, it seems like it was an office communication.
Some people clearly don’t see a difference between mentioning a part of a relationship and just stating what their sexuality is. One is appropriate in a much broader spectrum of settings than the other, regardless of what the sexuality of the person in question is, and I feel like people who don’t understand, or refuse to, are likely to be obnoxious to be around in general.
It’s weird how you’re moving goalposts in an analogy you created that misrepresented the situation anyway.
What goalpost got moved here? Literally the same thing I said before.
The amount of corporate bios I’ve read that talk about wives, husbands and family is astounding.
But I’m not totally sure what this is. It looks like someone joining the community to work for free? I might be wrong. If that’s the case they should be allowed to write whatever the hell they want as long as it’s not hurtful.
And super weird they’d take out “queer” but leave the furry thing. Not that there’s anything wrong with either.
First of all, this is not a professional setting, he’s not an employee there, and that forum is open for everyone.
Secondly, and way more important, people do that daily and no one cares especially when introducing oneself it’s common to mention stuff like your wife/husband and your preferred pronouns, hell, my corporate slack profile has my pronouns and those of everyone else. I’ve worked with trans people who introduced themselves as trans on the first day, and no one cared. So no, it’s perfectly okay for people to talk about themselves during an introduction even in professional settings.
Last but not least, people being uncomfortable is not a good reason to ban something, members of the KKK might be uncomfortable about working next to a black person, so what? Should the black person hide that he’s black to not make the others uncomfortable? That’s bullshit. If a person is uncomfortable by another one saying they’re queer, then that first person needs to deal with it, being queer is part of who the other person is and he shouldn’t have to hide who he is because someone might be uncomfortable about it. You mentioned religion, which I don’t think falls into the same category because religion is a set of beliefs that many people change through their lives, but still, people wear crosses daily in professional settings and no one cares.
Every corporate tech job I’ve had has dozens, if not hundreds, of openly queer people openly identifying as such. And that’s how it should be.
Whether it’s as simple as a rainbow or trans flag emoji in slack, as individual as speaking up internally about problematic anti-queer messaging, or as deep as an affinity group who coordinates pride events and such, it is and should remain acceptable and protected.
And honestly same with furry. I don’t care if who I am as a person may make someone uncomfortable. That’s solidly not my problem, and shouldn’t be an HR issue either.
Sweet Jeebus, do people here not ever take the time to read and comprehend a damn thing before they bandwagon and react?? You’re saying things that apply to zero of what I’ve said, and what the original topic is about. What in the world are you even on about? Who is saying anything about people identifying however they want? Did you even read the linked thread ffs? 🤦
I read your comment in full before replying to it. I don’t know how to help you connect the dots here.
Who ever said anything about people identifying as anything? That has nothing to do with what the discussion was. You’re extrapolating on something that isn’t there.
Edit: Christ, I’m not even saying controversial and I’m being brigaded ffs 🤣
Don’t worry about it. It’s Reddit refugees who haven’t yet figure out up/downvotes mean noþing in þe FediVerse. Þey’re still karma-farming þinking þey’re going to get gold some day.
'Politics: This topic has caused serious problems in the past and as such is subject to tight control. Discussion of the politics of open source it permissible in the lounge.
Ah yes, the 2 sexualities: Straight and political
This is the thing that makes me as angry as I am right now. This is exactly what they are doing.
Thanks! I’m going to reuse this.
The original content was restored and a comment made by a mod underneath the profile page of the guy says this :
The original text of this topic has been restored. The moderator action was a mistake and not reflective of the Ubuntu Diversity Policy 6.
As stated within the policy “…we explicitly honour diversity in age, culture, ethnicity, genotype, gender identity or expression, language, national origin, neurotype, phenotype, political beliefs, profession, race, religion, sexual orientation, socio-economic status, subculture and technical ability.” The Ubuntu community is for everyone.
reads like a stereotypically canned HR message.
Chat, please write an apology that clarifies Diversity Policy 15 and assures the reader that as a company we are not homophobic. Please use a professional, courteous tone and limit the response to 500 characters or less.
That’s a great idea! Here’s an apology that clarifies Diversity Policy 15, assuring the reader that the company is not homophobic, using a professional, courteous tone, limited to 500 characters or less:
We’d like to apologize for the incident. According to Diversity Policy 15, [company name] does not discriminate based on sexuality — this incident waInternal Error
What wording would you have them use?
did you respond to the wrong comment?
Good
It seems for the last 5 years or so, Ubuntu has done a good job of making everyone hate them.
I think historically Canonical has always been a bit or a weird company. I ended up ditching Ubuntu because they seem to have this weird penchant for picking some new shiny feature (Unity, the convergent Desktop/Phone OS thing, Mir, currently Snaps) and just going all-in on it whether people want it or not, working on it until it’s almost good, then ditching it for the next shiny thing.
Also their hiring process is apparently bonkers.
Upstart was the one that made me ditch it back in the day. I came back when they embraced the more sensible systemd
shit all you have to do is try to update/upgrade the thing and it’s like rolling the dice if it’ll bork your system or not so they’ve done an excellent job in people hating them for that one reason.
without fail whenever they roll out an update you’ll see threads on mastodon or bluesky with people saying “welp, my Ubuntu is fucked” after an update.
tbf ive been using it for years and never had it break on update.
That is the correct move for them. Once you have built a lot of capital, whether that be monetary, political, or social, then you spend the capital.
At least link to the correct thing: https://bark.lgbt/@gimmechocolate/115164408860865811
Holy Hell! The twists! (spoilers) I couldn’t believe when an Ubuntu mod said “if we let you say you’re queer, we would also have to let people say they hate you and want you dead.” I was even more shocked when they were acting appropriately- Nazis are a protected class at Ubuntu (this is only a little hyperbolic and also that’s all the spoilers)
Ubuntu is a South African ethical ideology focusing on people’s allegiances and relations with each other. The word comes from the Zulu and Xhosa languages. Ubuntu is seen as a traditional African concept, is regarded as one of the founding principles of the new republic of South Africa and is connected to the idea of an African Renaissance.
A rough translation of the principle of Ubuntu is “humanity towards others”. Another translation could be: “the belief in a universal bond of sharing that connects all humanity”.
“A person with ubuntu is open and available to others, affirming of others, does not feel threatened that others are able and good, for he or she has a proper self-assurance that comes from knowing that he or she belongs in a greater whole and is diminished when others are humiliated or diminished, when others are tortured or oppressed.”
–Archbishop Desmond Tutu
As a platform based on Free software, the Ubuntu operating system brings the spirit of ubuntu to the software world.
If you come from South Africa, you’ll know that Ubuntu is bullshit, in SA it’s just “fuck you, I got mine”.
Reddit flagged this as inaccurate and the mod added this:
The issue was never with the poster’s self identification. The Ubuntu Community Council have been contacted and have been discussing the issue since Friday it happened.
The Ubuntu Community Council rarely comments publicly when complaints are dealt with, but the moderation team is welcome to do so.
Because I am on the Ubuntu Community Council and have been working on this issue, I am unable to comment further at this time.
So “we’re not taking an anti-queer ‘Don’t say gay’ stance”
It’s inaccurate mis-information, our official policy "We don’t comment publicly about policies and complaints our official stance is ‘no comments’ "
I’m calling this a “big ouf” moment
That doesn’t make sense. The only change to the comment was to remove part of their statement of identity.
As a queer trans woman, I’m glad I switched to Fedora.
At least they are admitting it was wrong instead of doubling down
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So: “a few months ago, the Ubuntu Forums community merged with our Discourse community after being apart for quite a long time. During the merger, we simply adopted the Forums posting guidelines without a thorough review by the Community Council. We didn’t spot that the Forum had a stricter policy on politics and explicitly disallowed flags. Adding to that issue was a generational difference in the meaning of “queer”, and whether or not it’s still considered a slur.”
Okay.
